Would You Kill Lizards Hanging Around Your House & Pooping?

BillTre said:

It would be interesting to hear what you think would be a more effective way to deal with this kind of thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaria#Prevention said:

Methods used to prevent malaria include medications, mosquito elimination and the prevention of bites. As of 2022, there is one malaria vaccine for children which is licensed for use known as RTS,S. The presence of malaria in an area requires a combination of high human population density, high Anopheles mosquito population density and high rates of transmission from humans to mosquitoes and from mosquitoes to humans. If any of these is lowered sufficiently, the parasite eventually disappears from that area, as happened in North America, Europe, and parts of the Middle East.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anopheles#Eradication said:

Although mosquito control is an important component of malaria control strategy, elimination of malaria in an area does not require the elimination of all Anopheles mosquitoes. For instance, in North America and Europe, although the vector Anopheles mosquitoes are still present, the parasite has been eliminated. Some socioeconomic improvements (e.g., houses with screened windows, air conditioning), once combined with vector reduction efforts and effective treatment, lead to the elimination of malaria without the complete elimination of the vectors. Some important measures in mosquito control to be followed are: discourage egg-laying, prevent development of eggs into larvae and adults, kill the adult mosquitoes, do not allow adult mosquitoes into places of human dwelling, prevent mosquitoes from biting human beings and deny them blood meals.

BillTre said:

Killing people and insects are vastly different things.

BillTre said:

admit the low worth you have of human life in comparison with mosquitos.

jack action said:

Is it? This is assuming mosquitos are "evil" and play no other role than to kill humans. Very unlikely based on simple observations and errors committed in the past, trying to "correct" nature.

jack action said:

It is you who considers the low worth of mosquitos in comparison to humans.

jack action said:

It is a dangerous path to take. How many people need to die from one life form for one to decide to eradicate that life form? If one values human life above all, isn't a single human death enough?

jack action said:

Comparing one individual with another is one thing, comparing one life form over another is vastly different.

BillTre said:

Perhaps surprisingly, exterminators (at least in Oregon) know a lot about non-lethal ways to get rid of vermin.

BWV said:

cats and certain small dog breeds are good lizard killers. We had an American Eskimo dog that was a prolific lizard slayer

kyphysics said:

An acquaintance of mine says it depends on whether they are well-fed and domesticated at home or not. A hungry feral cat/dog might be great at catching these. But, he said a fat, lazy, pampered cat might be totally useless. He says his neighbor has many such cats. They won't even move an inch if a mouse walks by. Just stares and does nothing.

kyphysics said:

An acquaintance of mine says it depends on whether they are well-fed and domesticated at home or not. A hungry feral cat/dog might be great at catching these. But, he said a fat, lazy, pampered cat might be totally useless. He says his neighbor has many such cats. They won't even move an inch if a mouse walks by. Just stares and does nothing.

kyphysics said:

Someone should write/code an algorithm that figures out what happens in a defined ecosystem when you kill x, y or z members in it. I'd use that software and see what effects killing lizards, spiders, snakes, etc. have.

BillTre said:

They've been doing ecological studies on these things at least since the 1970's.
In each case you need to know a lot about how the ecosystem and how it parts interact before you could make any predictions.
Software along will not suffice.

BillTre said:

The main species of mosquito that transmits these many deadly diseases is invasive from Africa. The ecosystem there will probably be fine without it.

kyphysics said:

Someone should write/code an algorithm that figures out what happens in a defined ecosystem when you kill x, y or z members in it. I'd use that software and see what effects killing lizards, spiders, snakes, etc. have.

DaveC426913 said:

The trouble is, we don't know what is interlinked in the food web.

DaveC426913 said:

Invasive or no, it may still play an important part in the ecosystem. For example, bats feast on mosquitos. If the mosquitos go, it's possible the bats go. Or perhaps the bats stay and find a new food source, crowding out some other insectivore. The trouble is, we don't know what is interlinked in the food web.

gleem said:

That is exactly the problem with many disastrous interventions in ecosystems, the parts of an ecosystem are so interconnected that you cannot see how one part affects another. You remove some insignificant creature or plant when you destroy a habitat which causes another creature to either perish or adapt causing a domino effect as other creatures must adapt in response. This can result in a sort of butterfly effect.

Did you know that bats are a critical factor in the pollination of mangos, bananas, and avocados so the elimination of some species will come back to haunt us.

Nuisance animals are usually human acclimated and are a nuisance for a reason. Their control is necessary but must be effective. Fix the leak instead of constantly bailing out the boat

NYC is using carbon monoxide to kill rats which is very effective but they will return because the root cause of their infestation is not addressed. You have rats, mice, and cockroaches because your place is easy pickings.

Home Depot sells rat traps and poison, use them, they do not need to have food in the store for the small amount of revenue that it generates. Bird seeds on the other hand can be easily made inaccessible to mice and rats.

pinball1970 said:

Disagree,

gleem said:

With what? I don't advocate putting up with anything that is dangerous. It's them or us.

pinball1970 said:

Disagree, we can risk it. If we can introduce a sterile version (mosquito )into the population that takes over and causes its own destruction then we should do it.

pinball1970 said:

It is termed the world's "most dangerous animal" by the WHO for a reason.

DaveC426913 said:

That would collapse several branches of the ecosystem.

BillTre said:

How would this happen?
Several branches of the ecosystem?
What exactly do you mean by this?

DaveC426913 said:

Well, birds, bats, frogs, dragonflies, fish, spiders, turtles - depend on mosquitos, some species almost exclusively.
https://www.orkin.com/pests/mosquitoes/what-eats-mosquitoes
So let's see, that's mammals, reptiles, amphibians, birds, insects and fish.

While bats eat mosquitoes, they are far more effective at locating, catching and eating insects other than mosquitoes.

DaveC426913 said:

Bats can eat up to 1200 mosquitos per hour.
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+eats+mosquitoes

BillTre said:

There are many species of mosquitos

DaveC426913 said:

Well, birds, bats, frogs, dragonflies, fish, spiders, turtles - depend on mosquitos, some species almost exclusively.
https://www.orkin.com/pests/mosquitoes/what-eats-mosquitoes
So let's see, that's mammals, reptiles, amphibians, birds, insects and fish.

Bats can eat up to 1200 mosquitos per hour.
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+eats+mosquitoes

pinball1970 said:

Historically when you remove them locally

https://www.insectweek.org/blog/mosquitoes-and-the-panama-canal/#:~:text=Of the tens of thousands,the disease gets its name).

pinball1970 said:

Historically when you remove them locally

https://www.insectweek.org/blog/mos...e tens of thousands,the disease gets its name).

BillTre said:

Guess that's why Walter Reed has a hospital named after him.

The workers and engineers still viewed miasma theory (‘bad air’), foul tropical soils, and direct contact with infected persons as the causes of the disease. This lack of knowledge of its entomological transmission route in fact resulted in many disastrous decisions facilitating the disease to spread[3]. For instance, hospital wards in which the afflicted were treated were routinely kept with wide open windows, meaning mosquitos were free to enter, feast upon infected inpatients, and disperse freely to blight the healthy. Even worse, potted plants brought in to improve aesthetics provided females with pools of standing water: a perfect habitat in which to lay their eggs. The French were effectively culturing the disease in the very rooms in which the sick were being treated!

It was US army physician Major Walter Reed who finally demonstrated unequivocally thatAedes aegypti was the vector of the virus, building on the ‘mosquito hypothesis’ proposed by Cuban scientist Carlos Finlay in 1881. This was achieved through an ethically questionable, but simple experiment[5]. A newly emerged A. aegypti mosquito was taken by Reed, allowed to feed on a suffering patient, and then transferred – voluntarily – to his friends and co-workers. When they became sick with Yellow Fever days later (but thankfully surviving) the breakthrough had been made[5]. The Americans now knew how to succeed where the French had failed.

It was US army physician Major Walter Reed who finally demonstrated unequivocally thatAedes aegypti was the vector of the virus, building on the ‘mosquito hypothesis’ proposed by Cuban scientist Carlos Finlay in 1881. This was achieved through an ethically questionable, but simple experiment[5]. A newly emerged A. aegypti mosquito was taken by Reed, allowed to feed on a suffering patient, and then transferred – voluntarily – to his friends and co-workers. When they became sick with Yellow Fever days later (but thankfully surviving) the breakthrough had been made[5]. The Americans now knew how to succeed where the French had failed.

kyphysics said:

We get these lizard things (not sure if it's a lizard or some close reptile cousin) hanging around the sides of house and inside the garage (never inside the actual home). They leave poop everywhere.

I've caught a bunch with sticky traps. They walk across it and get stuck on them. They starve to death and die and we throw them away. I told this to a neighbor and he said he leaves them alone, because they eat the annoying bugs around you - even termites (which we think we NOW HAVE - as I found what seems to be a mud tube and a freaking small bug with white-ish wings near it).

So, for him, it's an easy trade-off. Less bugs and possibly even termi te prevention vs. lizard poop (which he can just clean up like dog poop).

Same question holds for possums. They are clumsy, shy, and weird looking animals. Yet, they eat all the really bad bugs around the neighborhood. Run them off our property or let them "hang out" to kill the annoying bugs?

DaveC426913 said:

I struggle with this too.

I prefer to think that my compassion for lower animals isn't about their pain so much as it is about me unable to turn off my empathy (i.e. I am projecting).